Curse

Diablo™ · May 08, 2006, 06:30 AM // 06:30

As much as I loved Factions and CE, I agree these elite missions are a downer for 95% of the GW populous.

misthero · May 08, 2006, 07:26 AM // 07:26

Elite mission are for elite ppl, I'm not in 1 of those Elite alliances, maybe I will never be. But having something that prevent me to enter becouse I'm not good enough make me thinking I can do it best. Make me fight. Give me a reason to keep trying.

If you think you have the right to enter those mission just because you pay the game you are wrong.

scamPOR · May 08, 2006, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by misthero

Elite mission are for elite ppl, I'm not in 1 of those Elite alliances, maybe I will never be. But having something that prevent me to enter becouse I'm not good enough make me thinking I can do it best. Make me fight. Give me a reason to keep trying.

If you think you have the right to enter those mission just because you pay the game you are wrong.

Amassing 2 million + faction has NOTHING TO DO with your own skill as a player... Personally I don't see this as an incentive to "Get better" but more as an annoying ohh now I need to join some awful guild with 1k players to be able to compete.

misthero · May 08, 2006, 07:31 AM // 07:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by scamPOR

Amassing 2 million + faction has NOTHING TO DO with your own skill as a player... Personally I don't see this as an incentive to "Get better" but more as an annoying ohh now I need to join some awful guild with 1k players to be able to compete.

Yep, and if A-Net make those missions accessible to everyone tomorrow, than tomorrow everyone would rant because they have the game ended and nothing to do anymore.

..And bye bye factions. Try to make a better alliance, if you wanna earn something more in game. If you wanna stay in your "1 man guild" than I think you will never see the elite content.

this game is called "Guild Wars" and is called "Factions".

salaboB · May 08, 2006, 07:36 AM // 07:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by misthero

But having something that prevent me to enter becouse I'm not good enough make me thinking I can do it best.

You mean you have a life (Well, maybe), and aren't spending enough time toting packages on repeatable quests to earn faction for your alliance to get in (This part at least is true, if not you'd be able to access them).

Explain how this means you're not good enough? It takes no skill to equip a couple speed boosts and trot back and forth on fedex quests.

Quote:

Originally Posted by misthero

Yep, and if A-Net thos mission accessible to everyone, than tomorrow everyone would rant becouse they have the game ended and nothing to do.

Oddly enough, I didn't see that right after the new tombs went in, even after people figured out how to beat it easily. If the new areas are as challenging as advertised, even with immediate access people won't get bored right away. If they do...Anet really needs to work on how to make areas difficult.

Sunai · May 08, 2006, 07:40 AM // 07:40

Personally I don't really care, but I see how some people would. It would be nice if more people got a chance at it, but demanding to give everyone access is a bit much. What would be the point of spending (as was thrown up earlier) 30k a day so you could own a town, then? So you can spend 5k more each time you want fireworks? Lol.

Then it'll just turn into people saying, "Hey, they're stupid enough to own a town.". It's a role-playing game; there should be rewards for powerful alliances.

Like I said, it would be nice if smaller guilds and individuals had a chance at it. It would also be nice if I was a billionaire irl and had everything made out for me. I realize games are there to immerse yourself in, to forget about the real world and be entertained, but there is always a line somewhere. It wouldn't be very fun, at least for me, to have had unlimited gold and all skill unlocks upon account creation, and had my character auto-levelled to 20 and given all locations and everything else you can imagine.

I just see this as something to strive for; to earn. Maybe that's my problem, since I'm not acting like I already deserve it. Saying you paid for Factions as a reason to get what you want just makes you look silly. You didn't pay for "access to elite missions whenever I want", you paid for "access to elite missions after me and my powerful alliance earn it". It says so right on the box. But this is apparently just being unaware of what you're actually buying.

I don't have anything against small guilds or alliances of close friends or family. This is even difficult for medium sized ones. But if you want to stay in small guilds with your friends, elite missions are something you have to sacrifice. Because face it: how would you survive against an alliance chock full of sleepless faction farmers? At the end of the day, they are far ahead of you in the amount of time and effort spent toward that goal. Put that on the battlefield, and they win. It may not be fair, but war isn't fair. You know there's a war going on and this is a role-playing game, right?

In 6 more months, it'll become a lot easier to own a town anyway. Right now, Factions is the new thing and everyone wants to get in on it. Of course the die-hards will control it for a while. Of course, we could always just skip to the end where you accept the unlimited gold and this unlock-everything button.

salaboB · May 08, 2006, 07:44 AM // 07:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunai

In 6 more months, it'll become a lot easier to own a town anyway. Right now, Factions is the new thing and everyone wants to get in on it. Of course the die-hards will control it for a while. Of course, we could always just skip to the end where you accept the unlimited gold and this unlock-everything button.

6 months will make no difference to the small alliances, the larger ones will still have more people back in Cantha than them. And who cares about owning -a- town, it's only the top one that matters...and that will always be held by the biggest, most farmingist alliance unless the entire mechanism changes.

Argen · May 08, 2006, 07:50 AM // 07:50

I don't have any problems with the elite missions... however, I do have one small problem... faction farming. If they find a way to get rid of that, I'm all for it. However, I will point out that the Supply missions are doable quickly with a particular build... over and over, it wouldn't surprise me if some of the guilds are doing this to build faction.

ANet gets rid of the mechanical Faction farming and viola, great idea.

misthero · May 08, 2006, 07:50 AM // 07:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by salaboB

6 months will make no difference to the small alliances, the larger ones will still have more people back in Cantha than them. And who cares about owning -a- town, it's only the top one that matters...and that will always be held by the biggest, most farmingist alliance unless the entire mechanism changes.

Than try to make a larger alliance, is not difficult to get faction points, you don't need to be good, what you need is ppl, join up and try it.

Shanaeri Rynale · May 08, 2006, 07:52 AM // 07:52

Quote:

Yep, and if A-Net thos mission accessible to everyone, than tomorrow everyone would rant becouse they have the game ended and nothing to do.

Then thats poor level design imho. There are any number of things to make this not happen, random missions when you go in. Hey why not even give the player base a tool where they can design missions(no rare drops mind, dont want to imbalance things) Look at games like morrowind/oblivion for example.

An SDK toolkit to let people design and implement their own levels would be a god send.

Quote:

Of course, we could always just skip to the end where you accept the unlimited gold and this unlock-everything button.

I think maybe you are making the wrong assumption. Players want to pit their wits and those of their friends against the challenges the levels of the game offers. They want to earn and feel the acomplishment of doing so. Ever tried to beat a personal best at something? Thats what this is about.

salaboB · May 08, 2006, 07:52 AM // 07:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by misthero

you don't need to be good

I play GW because it's (Supposedly) a game where skill matters more than time spent playing.

I am not going to play it so I can demonstrate that I have more time to spend than you. That completely defeats the purpose I have for playing the game.

dansamy · May 08, 2006, 07:52 AM // 07:52

Quote:

1)If you're guild/alliance owns cavalon/hzh you get for free.
2)If you're guild/alliance owns a supporting town you get in for half price.
3)If you're guild/alliance owns nothing you mus pay full price.
4)If you are not part of a guild, but have a group that wants to go in, you must pay double price.

There's not curently a fee to do the mission, but I support something like this, although I would want it to be made very expensive. Perhaps restructured so that it looks like this:

1) Cavalon HzH holders - free
2) "Second-best" town - 6k/party
3) Other supporting towns - 12k/party
4) Non-holders - 24k/party

As you can see, my spin would make it pricey, but not unbearable considering both the challenge and the potential for rewards. It would be expensive enough that only those with a committed team would even try to attempt it.

Sunai · May 08, 2006, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by salaboB

6 months will make no difference to the small alliances, the larger ones will still have more people back in Cantha than them. And who cares about owning -a- town, it's only the top one that matters...and that will always be held by the biggest, most farmingist alliance, period.

There is a limit to the amount of players in an alliance. Choosing to split their efforts just makes it easier for everyone else.

As long as the quest is(/is made) a real pain to run (I haven't tried it), or if missions and other one-time quests are the main source of faction, then I don't really see what's illogical in having the largest alliance of active players holding the capital city...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

I think maybe you are making the wrong assumption. Players want to pit their wits and those of their friends against the challenges the levels of the game offers. They want to earn and feel the acomplishment of doing so. Ever tried to beat a personal best at something? Thats what this is about.

You mean like those challenge mission thingies I've ran across? What are those for, anyway?

EDIT:

Quote:

Originally Posted by salaboB

I play GW because it's (Supposedly) a game where skill matters more than time spent playing.

I am not going to play it so I can demonstrate that I have more time to spend than you. That completely defeats the purpose I have for playing the game.

The point of Factions is not to hold a town. It's something to do after you beat the PvE campaign (which is based on skill), and if you're not interested in doing PvP (which is based on skill). It is extra.

LucasAshrock · May 08, 2006, 08:14 AM // 08:14

Lol this thread an the other one are so funny.

U really think it is so hard have 10k per day?
Black alliance is only a teenager alliance with a leader.
They recruit random for have more points and find real pro like me or others like me for their drop (don't worry i'm in a guild more better than them).
Now u think it is hard. Lol we will talk next month.
An alliance of 4 guilds can manage cavalon or hzh in 3 days. And don't needs of 100 players each.
Surely next month we will see a lot of alliance with a total of 100 or 200 members with their 10k per day, but there is the factions war.
If your alliance isn't enough , invite other guilds.
There are million of guilds. Don't worry.
And 10k per day is more easy than u think now.
The emperor of a great alliance will fight with other emperors.
Factions is great with this idea.
Simply start to organize for it.
Don't talk here with i will not see Elite mission. Start an alliance with other guilds.
I repeat, actually u can beat black alliance (teenager) with 3 days of work and 3 ally.
Don't try to join them. U don't need of them. Don't invite useless random ppl.
U don't need of hardcore gamers only but simply serious players for a fun gameplay.
And when 1 day will be emperors simply join 1 empire.
An empire needs of points and 1 guy can make the difference. Future will be different.
Have fun with factions.Trust me.

(P.S. zodiac weapons are awesome) (P.P.S. U have degen every 2 step too hard for normal players)

Thom · May 08, 2006, 08:27 AM // 08:27

In the spirit of competition, consider joining the second or third alliance not the one holding. Your second place team will be more likely to want your services than a team thinking that you just want to milk them. I am sure if you wanted it badly enough you could pay someone enough to enter.

Love it how people complain about how easy the game is and in the same breath want everythign to come easy.

Vaga · May 08, 2006, 08:43 AM // 08:43

The elite missions are very hard btw, there is no point having pugs allowed in there. If you are a friendly enough person I am sure that the alliances controlling the capitals will bring you along if they need someone.

I agree that there should be some sort of mission for people owning the other towns, although it is nice to have some kind of ''elite'' items that you know are never going to be farmed by hundreds of thousands of people, so maybe they could be kept in the elite.

The guilds holding the towns do not have 1000 people farming 10k faction a day, they do it by working as a team and getting faction.

IMO they should just add some elite missions to the towns, but not have the elite chests/zodiac items. They can still have decent amount of kurzick and luxon chests, as well as difficult challenges.

iladin · May 08, 2006, 08:52 AM // 08:52

The Kurzick elite mission is very hard with sucide bombers that kill you instantly, -15 degen global effects, -4 energy regen global effects and every spell exhausts effects, 20+ Lv 28mobs at time, odd requirements such as vampiric weapons and consume corpse/necrotic travel and takes about 4 hours to do. Your given twelve people to do it.

Its nice to go into a pug with only guildies or people who are friends of the guild.

I've seen and grouped with people from EviL, Te, and iGi so I know its not an exclusive thing.

Charging to enter is forbidden.

This basically is a favor of the gods debate.

master chief matt · May 08, 2006, 09:02 AM // 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vaga

The guilds holding the towns do not have 1000 people farming 10k faction a day, they do it by working as a team and getting faction

actualy, according to members of the black blades, 10k faction/day is the minimum to remain a member. and the leader said that since they control the house then they will only allow people in thier guild to join in on the missions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunai

Like I said, it would be nice if smaller guilds and individuals had a chance at it. It would also be nice if I was a billionaire irl and had everything made out for me. I realize games are there to immerse yourself in, to forget about the real world and be entertained, but there is always a line somewhere. It wouldn't be very fun, at least for me, to have had unlimited gold and all skill unlocks upon account creation, and had my character auto-levelled to 20 and given all locations and everything else you can imagine.

In 6 more months, it'll become a lot easier to own a town anyway. Right now, Factions is the new thing and everyone wants to get in on it. Of course the die-hards will control it for a while. Of course, we could always just skip to the end where you accept the unlimited gold and this unlock-everything button.

All of those things, in game and in real life, are acheivable by everyone and anyone. theres already unlimited gold in the game, just go and kill stuff, and anyone, including noobs on their first drop can unlock a 20/20 sundering mod or a +30hp mod. you dont get what im saying, im saying make it possible for anyone to get in, dont make it an automatic mission that anyone can get into right off the bat. Yes, i want to get in, but i do want it to be a challenge. and i want that challenge that anyone with a good group has the ability to accomplish at some point. its not right to say, these are the best, hardest, most elite missions in the game, but unless you get millions of faction points you cannot do them at all.

Also, im not saying we are entitled to everything right away, like auto-level 20 chars, or every town and outpost automaticaly opened, those are all things anyone can get/do, but take time and effort. If you would read what i said in the first post you will see that it is IMPOSSIBLE for any small guild to make an alliance, or even a large active guild to start an alliance and surpass the nearly 4million faction they ahve at this point, and there was even a member of the black blades who posted here on the first page stating that exact fact. The point is, we all payed for this game, we all deserve the right to make it to the elites, not teh right to try and form a 1000 person alliance, give up our jobs and lives and famillies to do fed-ex runs and scouting runs all the time. I honestly think we need specific guidlines to getting into the elite missions, but a pay/party req i really like the sound of, keeps noobs and bots out of them.

Thom · May 08, 2006, 10:10 AM // 10:10

"master chief" I am glad you have such a good grip on what is and isn't possible less than 2 weeks after release. If you spent as much time devising a way to gain access as you did complaining, you'd be on the right track.

3 million faction really isn't that difficult to get. If an alliance of 300 all dropped 10k they have access. 300 people is 10 guilds averaging 30 active. If you plan a weekend, you should be able to easily get that number. If you started a guild just to harvest faction you could find 300 casual players simply wanting to get elite access over a weekend. Fact is that people will be starting those types of guilds and if you are willing to spend a saturday farming, contributing 15-20k isn't that difficult.

master chief matt · May 08, 2006, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom

"master chief" I am glad you have such a good grip on what is and isn't possible less than 2 weeks after release. If you spent as much time devising a way to gain access as you did complaining, you'd be on the right track.

3 million faction really isn't that difficult to get. If an alliance of 300 all dropped 10k they have access. 300 people is 10 guilds averaging 30 active. If you plan a weekend, you should be able to easily get that number. If you started a guild just to harvest faction you could find 300 casual players simply wanting to get elite access over a weekend. Fact is that people will be starting those types of guilds and if you are willing to spend a saturday farming, contributing 15-20k isn't that difficult.

you're alliance doesnt control cavalon/hzh, the guild that has dropped the most faction to date has control, and thats straight from guildwars.com, gaile gray, messege boards on this site and on other sites. so its your guild, with 30 active members droping 10k a day, thats 300k a day. according to the black blades members ive talked to you must donate 10k faction per day that you are online, or you are kicked as a member, and that they are nearly full most of the time, with active members. so add that up and see how rediculousy hard it is to surpass them, and read on the first page where there is a member of the black blades saying it would be rediculous

Quote:

Originally Posted by You Don't Know Who I Am

Im part of the Luxon dynasty myself and it does seem a little unfair. Last time I checked, we had over 3.5 mil Luxon xp. To think that any alliance could catch up to something like that is unbelievable. Hell, our only challange is over 1mil behind us. I suppose they will have resets or eventually work out all the bugs. You must admit though, it was a very interesting concept to start off with though.